New Work, thought ahead: Interview with Marion King about self-efficacy and taking responsibility

We spoke to Marion King for our series with future shapers. What conclusions does the organisational expert and New Work specialist draw after fifteen years of practical reflection?

She is more interested in "good" work than innovative or "new" work. And that has implications in terms of taking responsibility and self-efficacy.

Professional Campus: Dear Marion, almost two years have passed since we last spoke - and many joint endeavours have come about: You are an important driving force behind the Witten MBA and play a crucial role in the SWITCH movement for planetary education, which was launched in Witten in autumn 2023. Your book 'Gute Arbeit! - An incitement to self-efficacy' was published. - Has your perspective changed in the meantime, have you noticed a change in the people and organisations you support?

Marion King: After these two years since our interview, or actually after a good ten years of work on the topic of 'New Work', I would say that we are still at the beginning of a possible change in our working world. It's still a pioneering time. My book was a good opportunity to think about exactly what the situation was like ten years ago and what has happened in the meantime. I found that at the beginning of the "New Work" movement, there was a great deal of enthusiasm for the topic, if not euphoria, and above all a sense of solidarity among those involved. Unfortunately, this energy has faded or shifted. Some of our companions have simply developed in other directions or specialisations, for example by focusing more on regenerative economic models - which is great, of course. Even if there is still quite a lot to do, there are a large number of people and organisations that have set out on the path to contemporary and sustainable work in recent years. The development towards more self-organisation, more agile and more participative forms of work has become a matter of course in many companies.

Professional Campus: Do you see the current state of development in organisations as a missed opportunity?

Marion King: I think it's a shame that the experiences from the Corona era in particular have not led to more fundamental changes. Although most people were or are aware that we need to change something, many organisations are continuing to work as before - especially in the care sector. The only significant change after coronavirus is the home office regulations. It's not just the companies or organisations that have failed here, but also the politicians. It would have been a really good opportunity. But transformation in times of polycrisis like these is not easy and, above all, cannot be achieved by decree or at the push of a button. It also requires knowledge and expertise in organisational development. I think that this expertise is lacking in many places. We consultants are too much of a bypass; our knowledge and experience have to go straight into the organisations, into the workforce.

And unfortunately, in the current times of crisis and war, I have observed that many companies are falling back into old patterns of behaviour and work, into "artificial" hierarchies, into top-down and announcement mode, because they believe that this gives them more security. I don't believe that. Maybe you, I, simply need a lot more patience. You have to see the whole thing as a process. And THAT has definitely started.

Professional Campus: Many younger people are no longer prepared to work in conventional organisations. Perhaps the new generation will become a source of inspiration by bringing new ideas into organisations?

Marion King: There is definitely a lot of potential there. I think we should listen carefully to the younger generations and learn from them! These young people are not lazy or work-shy, but have very good reasons to think and act the way they do now. Quite apart from that, I think that these generations are being lumped together far too much in the current debate, because there are also very different "factions". There are still those who want to have a traditional career, buy a house and start a family. There are those who simply want to do a job and earn money. And then there are those who want to realise themselves, who want to find themselves and for whom work is not really the most important thing in life. And there are many younger people who are currently completely at a loss and can't find their way. In any case, many of them are asking themselves the question: How do I want to deal with work at all? It's no wonder: they see their parents, who haven't really become happy (or happier) as a result of the racket of recent years. But the majority of companies still work according to old principles of power, competition and higher-faster-further. None of this is really worth striving for. And at the same time, we are leaving a broken earth for the younger generation to take care of. It's no wonder that this is an "angry generation".

"'Good work' is linked to planetary thinking and self-efficacy."

Professional Campus: You launched the SWITCH movement together with Sebastian Benkhofer and team. How do you bridge the gap between New Work and an awareness of planetary thinking and action?

Marion King: If you think "New Work" through to the end, you automatically arrive at questions of togetherness, meaningfulness, the environment, responsibility. It requires a change of perspective that is broadened by planetary thinking and includes not only the immediate environment of the organisation, but also the interaction with all living beings and, of course, the earth. In this project, I realised that this is quite a challenging perspective - especially when it comes to implementation: What does this mean in concrete terms? Where do I start? But whether in the private sphere, in the organisation or in the neighbourhood - it's about adopting a different attitude.

Professional Campus: Frederic Laloux, who has contributed significantly to the success and practicality of New Work in organisations, is also a prominent example of a transition from New Work to issues around the planet... Does New Work have to do with a particular attitude?

Marion King: Absolutely. It's not without reason that I chose the title 'Good Work' for my book. The 'new' in "New Work" doesn't have any quality at first. It's simply "just" "new". What has come much more into focus for me is responsibility, responsible organisation. Responsibility is a quality that has to do with ethical considerations - taking responsibility, whether towards fellow human beings, our planet and also for oneself: that has implications.

Professional Campus: That's very exciting, because responsibility is a particularly important topic here in Witten...

Marion King: Absolutely! I realise, especially after the last few months in cooperation with Witten/Herdecke University and dealing with the topic of planetary thinking and action, that this topic is becoming important to me.

Professional Campus: What does it take to take responsibility? The experiences after SWITCH show that it is not self-evident and requires a great deal of strength in many situations... Are there certain constellations or positions in the organisation in which it is easier to act responsibly? Or is it more a type thing?

Marion King: Of course, managers in organisations have a different or more responsibility and a different scope and opportunities than "normal" employees. I also think it is simply their duty to act responsibly. The more "responsibility" is an issue for the entire organisation, i.e. an attitude and value issue, the easier it is for individuals to get involved and commit themselves to it. But the fundamental fact is that we ALL have our sphere of influence and therefore our scope for action. We all, each and every one of us, can ALWAYS make an impact. It's called self-efficacy. This is also the basic idea behind my Les Enfants Terribles initiative, to support precisely this. WE ALL are the work. And that means we are all responsible for working and collaborating well. It's about us taking responsibility for our daily lives, including (but not only) for our work.

The concept of self-efficacy goes back to the Canadian psychologist and learning researcher Albert Bandura: he says that everyone IS self-efficacious at all times and always. It is neither a competence nor a learnt skill, but something that we all possess. Unfortunately, we sometimes don't realise this or there are situations in which our own self-efficacy is weakened, but in principle we can all act self-efficaciously. We can strengthen our self-efficacy through good role models or allies, for example. It is crucial to experience things, try things out and have good experiences; this strengthens our sense of self-efficacy.

Professional Campus: A very exciting thought: it doesn't necessarily need the manager to instigate something, you have it in your own hands...

Marion King: Exactly, you don't necessarily need them to do it. You can always do something, change something. Even if it's just in your own environment, with your colleagues, in the team. If necessary, this change might also mean quitting and looking for a better place to work. But if you stay, it's definitely good to look for allies. This ties in with the question of how a movement can develop momentum. At SWITCH, we have of course also looked into grassroots movements, which is quite a complex topic. From my own practical experience - I've had my own "New Work" community for a good ten years - I'm concerned with the question of who puts energy into it, what form it then takes and what such a structure needs in order to experience stability, but above all action. -

In any case, a community is a great space for resonance and experience, you experience mutual strengthening. I can only encourage everyone to find or found a community of practice, whether inside or outside their own organisation. It doesn't have to be formal. It's best if it's based on voluntarism and voluntary commitment anyway. And it doesn't have to be a big initiative - a handful of like-minded people can make quite a difference.

Professional Campus: In conclusion, and looking to the future, what can organisations do for a better society, perhaps even a better world?

Marion King: What would be really good: that they see themselves precisely as a responsible, a responsible organisation. This means that they should consider the consequences of their actions and their business activities. And not close their eyes and, above all, not just focus on maximising profits. It's about realising what you are doing in and with this world. The exciting question here is who benefits or who should benefit from what we do? Just the profits and the shareholders? Or all people, all partners who are connected to the organisation and our world? Thinking and acting accordingly would inevitably lead us in the direction of a "new economy"...